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Blackpill what do these "nice guy" comics have in common?

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they wouldn't work if the dude was attractive
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if the only problem with "nice guys" was how theyre entitled and socially unaware, then why do they need to also be depicted as ugly? its not like the impact of the comic would change if the dude was good looking...


...right???
 
I don't think these comics are arguing that looks don't matter. In fact, if the guy was good looking, what you have is not a "Nice Guy." What you have is a Disney villain. Your Gastons, your Hanses.
 
Pretty much, if the guy was good looking he could call the girl a slut and get her number in the same sentence.
 
I don't think these comics are arguing that looks don't matter. In fact, if the guy was good looking, what you have is not a "Nice Guy." What you have is a Disney villain. Your Gastons, your Hanses.
Gaston wasn't a villain, he was trying to rescue a pubescent girl who had been traumatized through being coerced into slavery to rescue her dying father.

Hans was enchanted by those fucking mountain trolls.
 
Gaston wasn't a villain, he was trying to rescue a pubescent girl who had been traumatized through being coerced into slavery to rescue her dying father.

Hans was enchanted by those fucking mountain trolls.

That's the modern day explanation. Yes, Beauty and the Beast is both yikes and problematic. But in the 90s it was fine for a teenager to be romantically involved. A kiss was harmless if you were, like, 16/17. And sure, Beast was "technically" abusive. But she was changing him! He got better! He was sorry!
 
That's the modern day explanation. Yes, Beauty and the Beast is both yikes and problematic. But in the 90s it was fine for a teenager to be romantically involved. A kiss was harmless if you were, like, 16/17. And sure, Beast was "technically" abusive. But she was changing him! He got better! He was sorry!
The horrible thing about this is we tend to focus so much on what a Chad that Gaston was, that we overlook that Beast was actually far more of a Chad than Gaston ever was.

Yes, he was a brooding loner without 3 bimbettes swooning over him but:
1) he was taller than Gaston
2) he was more muscular than Gaston
3) he was wealthier than Gaston (prince, owned own castle)
4) he mogs Gaston in violence (grapples wolves bare-handed instead of shooting deer)

The funny thing is, we never see any evidence that Belle bothered to try changing Gaston, even though Gaston hadn't done anything bad to her at all aside from expressing skepticism about reading.

Hell, the worst he ever did was have her dad locked up, which was what Beast had done to Belle's dad to begin with.

Belle was basically a whore who wanted a wealthy prince with a huge fucking library of free books to shlick to.

Also face it: the only reason she stuck with him after is because he turned out to be more handsome than Gaston:
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1579382670695

We all know damn well if he turned out short/ugly like LeFou that she would've fucking BOLTED.
320
 
The horrible thing about this is we tend to focus so much on what a Chad that Gaston was, that we overlook that Beast was actually far more of a Chad than Gaston ever was.

Yes, he was a brooding loner without 3 bimbettes swooning over him but:
1) he was taller than Gaston
2) he was more muscular than Gaston
3) he was wealthier than Gaston (prince, owned own castle)
4) he mogs Gaston in violence (grapples wolves bare-handed instead of shooting deer)

The funny thing is, we never see any evidence that Belle bothered to try changing Gaston, even though Gaston hadn't done anything bad to her at all aside from expressing skepticism about reading.

Hell, the worst he ever did was have her dad locked up, which was what Beast had done to Belle's dad to begin with.

Belle was basically a whore who wanted a wealthy prince with a huge fucking library of free books to shlick to.

Also face it: the only reason she stuck with him after is because he turned out to be more handsome than Gaston:
View attachment 191922View attachment 191923
We all know damn well if he turned out short/ugly like LeFou that she would've fucking BOLTED.
320

She didn't change Gaston because Beast was a good guy on the inside. He had a lesson to learn about not being mean to witches and stuff. What we're to believe about Gaston is, he's unredeemable.
 
She didn't change Gaston because Beast was a good guy on the inside.
He had a lesson to learn about not being mean to witches and stuff.
What we're to believe about Gaston is, he's unredeemable.
Beast was basically a ten year old boy when he got cursed by the witch because he didn't think a fucking FLOWER was adequate rent. As if some old hag was entitled to free rent just because she was old and wanted to pay with a fucking flower. Standard female entitlement:

There basically wasn't any lesson to learn at all, people were probably coming by all the time wanting free room+board in his castle and he's probably getting sick of being harassed about it.

In that respect, I can basically not blame Beast for locking up Maurice/Bell as unauthorized intruders. He has legit grounds to be pissed off. But at the same time: he should have realized that people thought the place abandoned/haunted, plus Beast's own servants were basically inviting Maurice in and he had no idea who the legit owner was.

Gaston didn't need to be redeemed, he didn't do anything wrong except tossing Bell's book into the mud. Big fucking deal compared to JAILING HER FATHER when Maurice was basically honeytrapped by that fucking candle.
 
Beast was basically a ten year old boy when he got cursed by the witch because he didn't think a fucking FLOWER was adequate rent. As if some old hag was entitled to free rent just because she was old and wanted to pay with a fucking flower. Standard female entitlement:

There basically wasn't any lesson to learn at all, people were probably coming by all the time wanting free room+board in his castle and he's probably getting sick of being harassed about it.

In that respect, I can basically not blame Beast for locking up Maurice/Bell as unauthorized intruders. He has legit grounds to be pissed off. But at the same time: he should have realized that people thought the place abandoned/haunted, plus Beast's own servants were basically inviting Maurice in and he had no idea who the legit owner was.

Gaston didn't need to be redeemed, he didn't do anything wrong except tossing Bell's book into the mud. Big fucking deal compared to JAILING HER FATHER when Maurice was basically honeytrapped by that fucking candle.


Yes, Beast was worse. But this was the 90s. It's not what you do, it's who you are behind the mask that counts. Today we know that you aren't obligated to let poor people sleep in your house, but in the 90s, not letting people sleep in your house was a sign that you just need to learn a bit more about the merits of charity.

Gaston, however, he doesn't want women to think for themselves. Could he be taught not to do that? Yes, but... it was the 90s, so we take it that he's just a bad guy.
 
Yes, Beast was worse. But this was the 90s. It's not what you do, it's who you are behind the mask that counts. Today we know that you aren't obligated to let poor people sleep in your house, but in the 90s, not letting people sleep in your house was a sign that you just need to learn a bit more about the merits of charity.
You don't teach noblesse oblige to a preteen boy by cursing his entire fucking household.

Gaston, however, he doesn't want women to think for themselves. Could he be taught not to do that? Yes, but... it was the 90s, so we take it that he's just a bad guy.
I assume you mean

"It's not right for a woman to read. Soon she starts getting ideas and thinking."

That's how transcripts tend to represent it, but it's wrong. Watch the actual scene:



It's actually more likely "and thinking..."

He hadn't necessarily completed his sentence. He was probably pausing to think himself: of how to describe what thoughts were dangerous.

So I don't take it as meaning "women shouldn't think" (that's ridiculous, it makes no sense, he JUST said he wishes she "paid attention to more important things" .. you can't pay attention to things without thinking!) but rather, about specific stuff that's a FUCKING WASTE OF TIME.

Like for example, obsessing over marrying a prince, which sets her expectations too high.

Plus Bell was walking around a busy town reading and could have gotten seriously hurt. She definitely was too fixated on it.

If you have a criticism, it's about his saying it's not right for a woman to read, which may be a bit extreme, but we should keep in mind that he probably thought women would waste their literacy on romance novels (which Belle WAS doing) in which case, it basically IS wrong of them to do it.
 
I assume you mean

"It's not right for a woman to read. Soon she starts getting ideas and thinking."

That's how transcripts tend to represent it, but it's wrong. Watch the actual scene:



It's actually more likely "and thinking..."

He hadn't necessarily completed his sentence. He was probably pausing to think himself: of how to describe what thoughts were dangerous.

So I don't take it as meaning "women shouldn't think" (that's ridiculous, it makes no sense, he JUST said he wishes she "paid attention to more important things" .. you can't pay attention to things without thinking!) but rather, about specific stuff that's a FUCKING WASTE OF TIME.

Like for example, obsessing over marrying a prince, which sets her expectations too high.

Plus Bell was walking around a busy town reading and could have gotten seriously hurt. She definitely was too fixated on it.

If you have a criticism, it's about his saying it's not right for a woman to read, which may be a bit extreme, but we should keep in mind that he probably thought women would waste their literacy on romance novels (which Belle WAS doing) in which case, it basically IS wrong of them to do it.


But then we'd be assuming Gaston had more to say after that. Gaston's priorities and ambitions are made clear throughout the movie, he doesn't want much for Belle except for her to serve him.
 
But then we'd be assuming Gaston had more to say after that.
It's a justifiable assumption. Belle essentially cuts him off before he can finish his thought, belittling him, so he gets defensive and drops his point.

His incomplete sentence makes no sense on it's own: he just got finished asking her to think about other things, have other ideas, so he clearly is not opposed to her having thoughts/ideas.

The bimbettes clearly have fewer thoughts/ideas than Belle and Gaston doesn't care about them.

Gaston values Belle's intelligence, her having thoughts/ideas, he just wants her to ground herself and focus that intellect on realistic problems instead of talking to geese about a book she's obsessing over about a prince.

Do you recall this exchange prior to "Bonjour" ?
B: Have you got anything new?​
M: Not since yesterday.​
B: That's all right. I'll borrow this one.​
M: That one? But you've read it twice!​
B: Well, it's my favourite!​

Belle basically WAS wasting her time rereading the same BS novel about Gigachad a THIRD time. She could've been reading other novels for the FIRST time, but basically showed her literacy was a fucking waste.

Gaston's priorities and ambitions are made clear throughout the movie,
he doesn't want much for Belle except for her to serve him.
If he merely wanted service, he had 3 bimbettes pining for him (since childhood, if you read the comics) who could've served that role.

This 'serve' idea I expect is you vaguely remembering this line:

"A rustic hunting lodge, my latest kill roasting on the fire and my little wife massaging my feet..."

There's nothing unilaterally servile about that at all: Gaston is describing providing a service (providing meat, which probably took HOURS of hiking through the forest tracking to get) and then getting service in return (a footrub).

A good relationship would involve a symbiotic exchange of services, and giving a footrub is definitely way less effort than hunting animals, so there isn't the slightest thing demeaning about this at all.

Keep in mind that Gaston describes this happening with SIX or SEVEN children playing on the floor: as in he wants Belle for a long-term relationship, and still plans to stick with her even after her vagina is stretched out having a half dozen "strapping boys like me".

He's in love with her!
 
Just donate money to the homeless, whilst giving blood and walking your dogs bro!
 
It's a justifiable assumption. Belle essentially cuts him off before he can finish his thought, belittling him, so he gets defensive and drops his point.

His incomplete sentence makes no sense on it's own: he just got finished asking her to think about other things, have other ideas, so he clearly is not opposed to her having thoughts/ideas.

The bimbettes clearly have fewer thoughts/ideas than Belle and Gaston doesn't care about them.

Gaston values Belle's intelligence, her having thoughts/ideas, he just wants her to ground herself and focus that intellect on realistic problems instead of talking to geese about a book she's obsessing over about a prince.

Do you recall this exchange prior to "Bonjour" ?
B: Have you got anything new?​
M: Not since yesterday.​
B: That's all right. I'll borrow this one.​
M: That one? But you've read it twice!​
B: Well, it's my favourite!​

Belle basically WAS wasting her time rereading the same BS novel about Gigachad a THIRD time. She could've been reading other novels for the FIRST time, but basically showed her literacy was a fucking waste.


If he merely wanted service, he had 3 bimbettes pining for him (since childhood, if you read the comics) who could've served that role.

This 'serve' idea I expect is you vaguely remembering this line:

"A rustic hunting lodge, my latest kill roasting on the fire and my little wife massaging my feet..."

There's nothing unilaterally servile about that at all: Gaston is describing providing a service (providing meat, which probably took HOURS of hiking through the forest tracking to get) and then getting service in return (a footrub).

A good relationship would involve a symbiotic exchange of services, and giving a footrub is definitely way less effort than hunting animals, so there isn't the slightest thing demeaning about this at all.

Keep in mind that Gaston describes this happening with SIX or SEVEN children playing on the floor: as in he wants Belle for a long-term relationship, and still plans to stick with her even after her vagina is stretched out having a half dozen "strapping boys like me".

He's in love with her!

I'm sure he did love her, and yes, the three bar chicks were arguably much hotter and dumber than Belle, but that doesn't matter in a Disney movie. Belle is more attractive despite the smaller tits and because she's pure. Gaston wants a woman that will serve him, but she has to be pure.

As for Gaston valuing Belle's intelligence, where is that in the movie? In fact, he criticizes one of her books for having no pictures, and the idea that one would have to read words and use their imagination.
 
Please, give me a break.
I'm supposed to believe "normies" care about homeless people? No they don't. No matter how try hard enough, they don't give a single fuck.
They ignore them like everybody else.

The rest is a pure form of fantasy from their little brains.
If it was at least funny and original. But that? Not good enough.
 
207a711f385cccd384fa87819e011677.jpg


I'm sure he did love her, and yes, the three bar chicks were arguably much hotter and dumber than Belle, but that doesn't matter in a Disney movie. Belle is more attractive despite the smaller tits and because she's pure. Gaston wants a woman that will serve him, but she has to be pure.

web-comics-disney-beauty-and-the-beast-hes-the-best-baker-in-town-come-on


What exactly is 'pure' about her?

h83AB5F1A


The bimbettes are probably not sluts like you assume. Yes, they hang out in a bar, but they're clearly fixated on Gaston and are probably still virgins because he refuses to fuck them.

As for Gaston valuing Belle's intelligence, where is that in the movie
The fact that he talks to her instead of just raping her?

Or the fact that he values her above the much hotter Bimbettes, any of whom would clearly marry him and bear his children?
640

Am I supposed to buy the idea that Belle is considered more physically attractive than them?

Belle doesn't flaunt her breasts, so Gaston might also admire her modesty, but that is ultimately about valuing her personality: valuing her mind.

Also he clearly knows her better than Beast. They've played together since they were children and he knows she likes animals.

LoliBelle
BelleLovesAnimals


You can also see in the comic adaptation that he describes her as 'the inventor's daughter' so despite calling Maurice a madman, he probably does value that family intellect.

InventorDaughter


Face it: we just inherently dislike Gaston because he's chad for his town (big fish in a small pond) and we cope and want Belle to be our waifu because we want her rejection of Gaston to seem virtuous, but in the end, she doesn't go for someone like LeFou, she is just holding out for Gigachad. She's the epitome of hypergamy, only a prince will do.

Beast turned out to be not that bad a guy, but Gaston couldn't really be expected to know that. Belle's testimony couldn't be trusted, she was clearly enamored with princes and had been held captive.

beauty-beast-prankd-comic.jpg


In fact, he criticizes one of her books for having no pictures, and the idea that one would have to read words and use their imagination.
Wrong.
"How can you read this? There's no pictures!"
This just clearly means he enjoys books with pictures in them. Pictures add a lot. For example, "2 Fuzzy 2 Furious" is a lot more pleasant than "Squirrel Meets World" because of the cute little pictures of Doreen / Ana Sofia at the start of their respective chapters. The occasional picture inside the 'Lumberjanes' novels also makes them a lot more enjoyable, even though it moves away from the mostly-pictures feel of the comics.

Gaston is not critical of the use of imagination: he uses it himself and encourages Belle to use hers. Thus the whole "picture this... a hunting lodge" speech. He just likes books with pics (I do too, even though I've read dozens of novels with no pics inside, just a pic cover)

The irony of this is... there actually ARE pictures in the book she was singing about in the start. You can see a full-page picture when she's for some reason shouting about the book's plot in the middle of town to sheep at the fountain who just want to eat the paper.

BookPic


Also worth highlighting: Belle is basically borrowing books for free from the cucked bookshop owner, treating it like her personal library (it's not a public library) and despite this, when the sheep starts EATING THE PAGE, she DGAF and keeps singing to the sheep instead of being upset that this prized asset the guy lent her (which he needs to eventually SELL to earn a living, FFS) was damaged. Utterly inconsiderate.
 
Knew the answer before even clicking.
Water is very very wet.
 
What exactly is 'pure' about her?

h83AB5F1A


The bimbettes are probably not sluts like you assume. Yes, they hang out in a bar, but they're clearly fixated on Gaston and are probably still virgins because he refuses to fuck them.

It's not virginity that makes Belle pure, it's that she's smart and is focused on listening with the heart, instead of the "shallow" stuff like in Gaston's song. She reads books and stuff. Meanwhile the bar hoes are all about how strong Gaston is and how thick his neck is. And it's that purity that makes her more attractive than them. By Disney movie standards.

The fact that he talks to her instead of just raping her?

Or the fact that he values her above the much hotter Bimbettes, any of whom would clearly marry him and bear his children?
640

Am I supposed to buy the idea that Belle is considered more physically attractive than them?

Belle doesn't flaunt her breasts, so Gaston might also admire her modesty, but that is ultimately about valuing her personality: valuing her mind.

Not raping her doesn't mean he values her intelligence. He doesn't have to rape her, he believes he can persuade her to see things his way. Because why wouldn't he be able to? No one says no to Gaston.

Also he clearly knows her better than Beast. They've played together since they were children and he knows she likes animals.

View attachment 191949View attachment 191947

You can also see in the comic adaptation that he describes her as 'the inventor's daughter' so despite calling Maurice a madman, he probably does value that family intellect.

View attachment 191954

Disney Hit! Comics was never canon. Also, you're dismissing that he calls him a madman. We know for a fact that he calls Maurice crazy. You're substituting the words we know he says in the movie for assumptions about feelings he might have, drawn from this non-canon comic series.

Beast turned out to be not that bad a guy, but Gaston couldn't really be expected to know that. Belle's testimony couldn't be trusted, she was clearly enamored with princes and had been held captive.

beauty-beast-prankd-comic.jpg

The point of the mob rallying to kill Beast was to show that they, and Gaston, fear what they don't understand. Yeah today we know that Beast is pretty bad, worse than Gaston, but in a 90s Disney movie the message is "Look at the person beneath the beastly exterior. Don't judge a book by it's cover."

"How can you read this? There's no pictures!"
This just clearly means he enjoys books with pictures in them. Pictures add a lot. For example, "2 Fuzzy 2 Furious" is a lot more pleasant than "Squirrel Meets World" because of the cute little pictures of Doreen / Ana Sofia at the start of their respective chapters. The occasional picture inside the 'Lumberjanes' novels also makes them a lot more enjoyable, even though it moves away from the mostly-pictures feel of the comics.

Gaston is not critical of the use of imagination: he uses it himself and encourages Belle to use hers. Thus the whole "picture this... a hunting lodge" speech. He just likes books with pics (I do too, even though I've read dozens of novels with no pics inside, just a pic cover)

The irony of this is... there actually ARE pictures in the book she was singing about in the start. You can see a full-page picture when she's for some reason shouting about the book's plot in the middle of town to sheep at the fountain who just want to eat the paper.

View attachment 191955

The picture in the book is a continuity error, yeah. But you shouldn't need pictures to enjoy the book. By being able to enjoy a book whether or not there's pictures in it, Belle is shown to be smarter than Gaston. Gaston needs pictures. Therefore he's dumb.

And him telling her about the life he's envisioned for them isn't the same as being able to enjoy a pictureless book. He literally questions the potential for enjoying this pictureless book, because it has no pictures. This much we know.

Also worth highlighting: Belle is basically borrowing books for free from the cucked bookshop owner, treating it like her personal library (it's not a public library) and despite this, when the sheep starts EATING THE PAGE, she DGAF and keeps singing to the sheep instead of being upset that this prized asset the guy lent her (which he needs to eventually SELL to earn a living, FFS) was damaged. Utterly inconsiderate.

Yeah, the movie doesn't take a lot of time to consider how the bookshop owner feels about his books being wantonly borrowed. Or how he feels about letting Belle borrow them. He might secretly not want to. But the movie never establishes that he doesn't want to. We can come up with all kinds of fan theories, but what matters is what the movie tells us.
 
Arent neckbeards/niceguys just inceltears users?
 
Does anyone here honestly not shave, allow themselves to get overweight, and expect women to date you after saying retarded fucking jokes?
Also why does atheism revolve around this lol, weird stereotypes.

I'm clean shaven, fit, employed, in university, and have my shit together. But, I'm facially ugly. There's nothing you can do about that..

I'd love them to add an 18x operator as a Incel stereotype lmao, they're so generalizing it's a joke.
 
The tiny normie brain can't comprehend that "nice guys" and incels are the way they are because they were trated like shit by women all their lives and not the other way around
 
Does anyone here honestly not shave, allow themselves to get overweight, and expect women to date you after saying retarded fucking jokes?
Also why does atheism revolve around this lol, weird stereotypes.

I'm clean shaven, fit, employed, in university, and have my shit together. But, I'm facially ugly. There's nothing you can do about that..

I'd love them to add an 18x operator as a Incel stereotype lmao, they're so generalizing it's a joke.
Their tiny normie brains can't comprehend that "nice guys" and incels are the way they are because they were treated like shit by women all their lives and not the other way around.
 
Beast was basically a ten year old boy when he got cursed by the witch because he didn't think a fucking FLOWER was adequate rent. As if some old hag was entitled to free rent just because she was old and wanted to pay with a fucking flower. Standard female entitlement:

There basically wasn't any lesson to learn at all, people were probably coming by all the time wanting free room+board in his castle and he's probably getting sick of being harassed about it.

In that respect, I can basically not blame Beast for locking up Maurice/Bell as unauthorized intruders. He has legit grounds to be pissed off. But at the same time: he should have realized that people thought the place abandoned/haunted, plus Beast's own servants were basically inviting Maurice in and he had no idea who the legit owner was.

Gaston didn't need to be redeemed, he didn't do anything wrong except tossing Bell's book into the mud. Big fucking deal compared to JAILING HER FATHER when Maurice was basically honeytrapped by that fucking candle.


JFL based analysis
 
It's not virginity that makes Belle pure, it's that she's smart and is focused on listening with the heart, instead of the "shallow" stuff like in Gaston's song.
How is Belle smart? Has she invented anything? Pretty sure it's just her DAD who does that. Here's what I've seen Belle do:
1) walk around town (admittedly with good spatial awareness and peripheral vision) singing about how boring the place is while people are hard at work baking bread to feed her
2) borrow romance novels from a horny geezer and allow goat to eat them
3) interrupt guy engaging in logical criticism of her reading choices to intentionally misinterpret his comments

She reads books and stuff.
twilight091123_560.jpg


Meanwhile the bar hoes are all about how strong Gaston is and how thick his neck is.
The bimbettes are not whores at all: they are competing to be Gaston's wife. There's nothing at all wrong about admiring a man's strength. It speaks to his abilities as a provider and protector.

And it's that purity that makes her more attractive than them. By Disney movie standards.
There isn't any purity though. Belle is fixated on a prince whisking her away. The bimbettes are basically being shamed because they're willing to settle for a local hunter instead of pining to become a Disney Princess.

you're dismissing that he calls him a madman.
We know for a fact that he calls Maurice crazy.
Actually it's LeFou initially who called him a "crazy old loon" and Gaston admittedly laughs about it, then 180s when it realizes it upset her:

Note however that the 'genius' basically blew up his house immediately after Belle defended him, so there were some rational grounds for the townsfolk being suspicious about him.

The point of the mob rallying to kill Beast was to show that they, and Gaston, fear what they don't understand. Yeah today we know that Beast is pretty bad, worse than Gaston, but in a 90s Disney movie the message is "Look at the person beneath the beastly exterior. Don't judge a book by it's cover."
By what they had to go on (picture of a roaring beast, explains why Belle had vanished for months) rallying a mob seems like a logical thing to do.

Belle is shown to be smarter than Gaston. Gaston needs pictures. Therefore he's dumb.
He doesn't necessarily NEED them, he probably just LIKES them.

Gaston has accomplished way more than Belle. He is a provider. He applies his inteligence to hunt game for the town. Belle just lives in her father's house and reads books she doesn't pay for, treading local shop like her personal library.

And him telling her about the life he's envisioned for them isn't the same as being able to enjoy a pictureless book. He literally questions the potential for enjoying this pictureless book, because it has no pictures. This much we know.
Except there were pictures, so he was probably just fucking with her and not even looking at what he was flipping through.

Probably because he knows she just reads prince-romance trash.
 
The tiny normie brain can't comprehend that "nice guys" and incels are the way they are because they were trated like shit by women all their lives and not the other way around
 
How is Belle smart? Has she invented anything? Pretty sure it's just her DAD who does that. Here's what I've seen Belle do:
1) walk around town (admittedly with good spatial awareness and peripheral vision) singing about how boring the place is while people are hard at work baking bread to feed her
2) borrow romance novels from a horny geezer and allow goat to eat them
3) interrupt guy engaging in logical criticism of her reading choices to intentionally misinterpret his comments

You don't have to be an inventor to be smart. Reading books is a stereotypical marker of being cultured and smart. That's why they made Belle a lover of books. And obviously Beauty and the Beast predates Twilight, when they say "books" they don't mean trash. In fact they differentiate Belle's books from the non-cerebral picture books that Gaston likes by establishing that her books don't (or shouldn't, barring animation errors) have pictures. And for a book to rely on pictures instead of flowery prose that smart people can take to, makes it a dumb book.

The bimbettes are not whores at all: they are competing to be Gaston's wife. There's nothing at all wrong about admiring a man's strength. It speaks to his abilities as a provider and protector.

Again, they're whores because they're shallow, they're focusing on what the movie establishes to be shallow things. If they were not whores, they would be singing songs about what a good person with a good heart and personality Gaston had. How loving he was. And if Gaston wasn't a villain, he would have a good heart and personality and be a good loving person. He wouldn't have dismissed Maurice's concerns about Belle.



To address your other point...

Actually it's LeFou initially who called him a "crazy old loon" and Gaston admittedly laughs about it, then 180s when it realizes it upset her:

We see in that clip that Gaston echoes the "Crazy Old Maurice" jab after he has Maurice thrown out and Belle not seen to.

Note however that the 'genius' basically blew up his house immediately after Belle defended him, so there were some rational grounds for the townsfolk being suspicious about him.

Again, the message of the movie is to recognize the potential on the inside, not the superficial. Yes, life is not that simple, but again I say this is a Disney movie from the 90s and the message is that we're supposed to look at Maurice and go "He's not crazy! He's a genius! You guys just don't see the mind that's inside! You just see his mistakes!"

By what they had to go on (picture of a roaring beast, explains why Belle had vanished for months) rallying a mob seems like a logical thing to do.

Their motives were based in fear of what's different. The song says as much.

We don't like what we don't
Understand and in fact it scares us
And this monster is mysterious at least

Beast being mysterious is the minimum reason they need to kill him. The movie is about looking at the mind and soul inside, not the outer beauty/ugliness. Not looking with your eyes, but with your heart and mind.

He doesn't necessarily NEED them, he probably just LIKES them.

Gaston has accomplished way more than Belle. He is a provider. He applies his inteligence to hunt game for the town. Belle just lives in her father's house and reads books she doesn't pay for, treading local shop like her personal library.


Except there were pictures, so he was probably just fucking with her and not even looking at what he was flipping through.

Probably because he knows she just reads prince-romance trash.

"Probably?" You're basing this on a continuity error. What we know are the words he said: "How can you read this? There's no pictures!" Implying that the book, as far as he knew, COULD NOT be read without pictures. He doesn't see it possible to read a book without pictures. If he really did want her to be smart and have agency and listen with her heart and all that stuff, the movie would've established that. You wouldn't be relying on "probably." There'd be at least one song about it.
 
You don't have to be an inventor to be smart. Reading books is a stereotypical marker of being cultured and smart. That's why they made Belle a lover of books.
I didn't say you had to be. I think Gaston is smart because he is a skilled hunter. You can't be an idiot an a competent hunter.

Literacy is an admirable skill, but as we see in present day, it does not make you particularly smart or cultured, and it never did. Traditionally it just meant you were privileged, ie your dad is an inventor who made sure you were taught to read.

And obviously Beauty and the Beast predates Twilight, when they say "books" they don't mean trash.
Sure they do. She gave a summary of the contents to the book seller "Far-off places... daring sword fights, magic spells, a prince in disguise."

Then later what she re-iterates "Here's where she meets Prince Charming But she won't discover that it's him Till chapter three"

I'm trying to think of what sort of story that might refer to. The "won't discover" disguise is consistent. Not sure if it's just meant to be foreshadowing to her not knowing that Beast is actually Prince Adam until much later.

That she uses the phrase "Prince Charming" shows that despite being in her late teens she's basically reading pre-teen fairy tale basics.

I do owe Belle an apology though, I overlooked that the book seller said "if you like it so much, it's yours :soy:". He basically gave her the book so I guess if she wants to feed her gift to goats, that's her right.

My guess is that the book was such trash that nobody was buying it anyway (note that it always seems to be there prior to her 2nd and 3rd checkouts) so he would be freeing up some space in his store by tossing it.

In fact they differentiate Belle's books from the non-cerebral picture books that Gaston likes by establishing that her books don't (or shouldn't, barring animation errors) have pictures.
Who are you to say this is an animation error?

You could just as easily say this was a script error.

Probably depends on which portion of the scene was done first.

The illustration has a caption "le prince charmant" which matches Belle's dialogue with the sheep. It's entirely intended.

A more likely explanation is that they ad-libbed Gaston's lines, and you can No-Prize explain it as pics being rare and Gaston flipping the page so rapidly he didn't notice it.

And for a book to rely on pictures instead of flowery prose that smart people can take to, makes it a dumb book.
Having few/no pictures doesn't mean a book actually has flowery prose. She was most likely reading Sleeping Beauty or similar, based on her summary.

Keep in mind the book she just finished, as mentioned to the baker "I just finished the most wonderful story... - about a beanstalk and an ogre"

Maybe that's advanced reading in an age of mass illiteracy, but JATB is not a particularly long tale: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/English_Fairy_Tales/Jack_and_the_Beanstalk

Most of the mass of the book she was returning would've had to have been pictures, unless it was in a crazy large font.

Again, they're whores because they're shallow, they're focusing on what the movie establishes to be shallow things. If they were not whores, they would be singing songs about what a good person with a good heart and personality Gaston had. How loving he was.
They were singing about that. In so many words. Complimenting him as a "brute" is talking about his personality. They are admiring how straight-forward he is.

Talking about his thick neck is talking about his lifestyle : his is a personality who chooses to engage in athletic endeavours which work his neck muscles and thus thicken them attractively. Gaston knew how to gym-max.

And if Gaston wasn't a villain, he would have a good heart and personality and be a good loving person. He wouldn't have dismissed Maurice's concerns about Belle.
You don't need to constantly indulge the fantasies of dangerous deluded people to be a good person.

We see in that clip that Gaston echoes the "Crazy Old Maurice" jab after he has Maurice thrown out and Belle not seen to.
A broken clock is right twice a day, Maurice being correct about the Beast existing doesn't mean he deserved to be believed. We have no idea what crazy shit he's done prior to this.

Again, the message of the movie is to recognize the potential on the inside, not the superficial. Yes, life is not that simple, but again I say this is a Disney movie from the 90s and the message is that we're supposed to look at Maurice and go "He's not crazy! He's a genius! You guys just don't see the mind that's inside! You just see his mistakes!"
If Maurice were particularly smart in any applied sense then he wouldn't eat to the point of chronic obesity like me or Le Fou, he would be fit like Gaston.

Their motives were based in fear of what's different. The song says as much.

We don't like what we don't
Understand and in fact it scares us
And this monster is mysterious at least
Being scared of what you don't understand is a sensible precaution.
Disliking that lack of understanding: also sensible.
Nothing at all wrong with the villagers expressing their feelings like this.

Beast being mysterious is the minimum reason they need to kill him.
The movie is about looking at the mind and soul inside, not the outer beauty/ugliness.
Not looking with your eyes, but with your heart and mind.
There is only the mind, "heart" is BS just describing an aspect of the mind.
The mind is fed information by senses like vision, which is then processed.

The villagers did not merely see that the beast looked bestial, but also that he ACTED bestial.
Remember: they saw through the magic mirror that beast was howling like a madman. Roaring.

"Hear him roar, see him foam" is a reference to that.
The very first reaction upon Belle showing the mirror is a woman asking "is it dangerous?" which is a VERY LOGICAL THING TO ASK considering it's baring it's fangs, aiming it's snout at the air and roaring like a lion.
Belle even acknowledges "I know he looks vicious".
This "he's really kind and gentle" she expects everyone to believe is standard foid behavior they would be well aware of. We see it today where GFs try to excuse their violent criminal BFs.

Also take a close look at the villagers who came to Maurice's house. They were already wielding pitchforks and knives, even though nobody knew about the beast. All they knew is the asylum-keeper had come to collect the old man.

Why would that all be necessary for a simple good non-dangerous old man? Obvious reason: he was dangerous. The guy dealt with explosives, he built an automatic axe-chopping wagon, etc. He was a weapons dealer, so they had to bring weapons to make sure he came in peacefully.

Despite Le Fou's lyric referring to Maurice as a "harmless crackpot", that's obviously not true: he's very dangerous, not harmless at all.

"Probably?" You're basing this on a continuity error.
What we know are the words he said: "How can you read this? There's no pictures!"
Implying that the book, as far as he knew, COULD NOT be read without pictures.
He doesn't see it possible to read a book without pictures
That's not a logical interpretation. If I said "How can you read this? There's no dragons!" it doesn't mean I'm incapable of reading a book lacking dragons, it's just that I prefer books that have dragons. Gaston is just expressing how he thinks pictures make books better: meaning he DOES see value in books.

If he really did want her to be smart and have agency and listen with her heart and all that stuff, the movie would've established that. You wouldn't be relying on "probably." There'd be at least one song about it.
No, this is the problem in your approach. You are only looking at the story as the writers desire you to see it, the subjective experience.
I look at this objectively, and realize that the truth of matters is not always what is sung.

Belle is Gaston's childhood peer. The comics show them sledding together as children. He said he's loved her since they first met, and all that time he's been ducking the affections of the Bimbettes (also peers since childhood) because of his dedication to her.

Belle is clearly not any aesthetically better than the Bimbettes. So the reason Gaston likes her is her personality.

The bimbettes basically throw themselves at him. They bare their bosom to attract his gaze, they constantly hang out around him to try and get his interest.

Gaston, however much he might talk about the dangers of women getting ideas, is clearly attracted to Belle because of hers. That's why he rejects the bimbettes. You see this in the comics: one of them actually disguises as Belle to try and fuck him and as soon as he discovers it's not Belle, he rejects her.

They even try to make him jealous by flirting with Le Fou and he DGAF because Belle is the priority. This proves he's not just after Belle because she's "hard to get" because even when the bimbettes play hard to get, he's not interested.

Gaston is basically trying "negging" PUA tactic, trying to charm Belle by fucking with her hobby to try and get her to pay attention to him. It's childish and shit (ie it's standard Gilbert Blythe pigtail-tugging BS) to chuck her book in the muck or claim it's shit because it doesn't have enough pics, but it doesn't mean it's literally what he thinks.

Belle is horribly hypergamous which you can see as soon as she rejects Gaston's marriage proposal. She doesn't merely call him "boorish" but also "brainless", even though he's clearly a skilled hunter which takes intelligence. Remember the song "no one shoots like Gaston". This guy spends a lot of time developing a difficult skill, which has everything to do with mental focus and naught to do with genetics.

Then she whines about wanting more than "provincial life", supposedly "adventure in the great wide somewhere" except we finally find out that all she wants is to live in a massive castle with a free library and a prince and his servants to wait upon her. If she actually wanted adventure, she could've pursued that at any point by going hunting instead of just reading books in the town square.
 
The nice guy meme unironically shits on the “just be urself” advice
 
they wouldn't work if the dude was attractive
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if the only problem with "nice guys" was how theyre entitled and socially unaware, then why do they need to also be depicted as ugly? its not like the impact of the comic would change if the dude was good looking...


...right???
Yea. If looks don’t matter, then why do they portray the me as being ugly. They probably became so socially Inept simply because they have been rejected all their lives for being ugly.
 
You don't have to be an inventor to be smart. Reading books is a stereotypical marker of being cultured and smart. That's why they made Belle a lover of books. And obviously Beauty and the Beast predates Twilight, when they say "books" they don't mean trash. In fact they differentiate Belle's books from the non-cerebral picture books that Gaston likes by establishing that her books don't (or shouldn't, barring animation errors) have pictures. And for a book to rely on pictures instead of flowery prose that smart people can take to, makes it a dumb book.



Again, they're whores because they're shallow, they're focusing on what the movie establishes to be shallow things. If they were not whores, they would be singing songs about what a good person with a good heart and personality Gaston had. How loving he was. And if Gaston wasn't a villain, he would have a good heart and personality and be a good loving person. He wouldn't have dismissed Maurice's concerns about Belle.



To address your other point...



We see in that clip that Gaston echoes the "Crazy Old Maurice" jab after he has Maurice thrown out and Belle not seen to.



Again, the message of the movie is to recognize the potential on the inside, not the superficial. Yes, life is not that simple, but again I say this is a Disney movie from the 90s and the message is that we're supposed to look at Maurice and go "He's not crazy! He's a genius! You guys just don't see the mind that's inside! You just see his mistakes!"



Their motives were based in fear of what's different. The song says as much.

We don't like what we don't
Understand and in fact it scares us
And this monster is mysterious at least

Beast being mysterious is the minimum reason they need to kill him. The movie is about looking at the mind and soul inside, not the outer beauty/ugliness. Not looking with your eyes, but with your heart and mind.



"Probably?" You're basing this on a continuity error. What we know are the words he said: "How can you read this? There's no pictures!" Implying that the book, as far as he knew, COULD NOT be read without pictures. He doesn't see it possible to read a book without pictures. If he really did want her to be smart and have agency and listen with her heart and all that stuff, the movie would've established that. You wouldn't be relying on "probably." There'd be at least one song about it.

I like how you insist on getting your ass torn up on this topic :feelskek:
 
Ugly people have been shated on and made fun since forever
 
I like how they try to show how "nice guys" have bad personalities by unmistakeably drawing them ugly.
 
You are only looking at the story as the writers desire you to see it, the subjective experience.

Yes, that was the whole discussion. What the movie is supposed to be about. But what the movie is about is objective. Yours and my personal interpretations, those are subjective. "Objective" means "true regardless of whatever either of us say," and what's objectively true is what the intended message and themes and characterizations of the movie are.
 
what's objectively true is what the intended message and themes and characterizations of the movie are.
Intentions are never objectively true, we can have creators give statements about intentions but those could differ from their ACTUAL intentions.

Like for example, the creators of All Dogs Go To Heaven would never state their intention was to arouse young boys with Annabelle (the Whippet Angel) but they very well may have intended that, as that was the result.
 
Intentions are never objectively true, we can have creators give statements about intentions but those could differ from their ACTUAL intentions.

Like for example, the creators of All Dogs Go To Heaven would never state their intention was to arouse young boys with Annabelle (the Whippet Angel) but they very well may have intended that, as that was the result.

But then that means intentions ARE true, it's just what they say the intentions are is the lie. So you're saying the writers of Beauty and the Beast were lying and this was... what, they intentionally made Gaston a good person but also told us we should hate him? If the intention was to arouse young boys with Annabelle, there's a reason people would lie about that. Because it's abhorrent to arouse young boys. But this theory of yours, it's so bizarre there's no reason to even attempt it, let alone lie about this master stroke of 3D chess writing.
 
But then that means intentions ARE true,
I'm talking about things you can actually evalute. You can only objectively evaluate intention itself, only subjectively interpret it through the objective analysis of declarations.

So you're saying the writers of Beauty and the Beast were lying and this was... what, they intentionally made Gaston a good person but also told us we should hate him?
Where are you told you should hate him? Movies don't generally instruct people to do that, they form their own conclusions.

it's abhorrent to arouse young boys
No it isn't, I'm glad Annabelle and Princess Camille and Sally Acorn and all that were arousing cute girls in toons. They set high standards for foids so that I would aspire and not just pedestal whatever degenerate filth was around me like most normy copers do.

But this theory of yours, it's so bizarre there's no reason to even attempt it, let alone lie about this master stroke of 3D chess writing.
If you think I'm the first to provide alternative interpretations of Gaston, you're mistaken. It's common enough it is not bizarre.
 
I'm talking about things you can actually evalute. You can only objectively evaluate intention itself, only subjectively interpret it through the objective analysis of declarations.


Where are you told you should hate him? Movies don't generally instruct people to do that, they form their own conclusions.


No it isn't, I'm glad Annabelle and Princess Camille and Sally Acorn and all that were arousing cute girls in toons. They set high standards for foids so that I would aspire and not just pedestal whatever degenerate filth was around me like most normy copers do.


If you think I'm the first to provide alternative interpretations of Gaston, you're mistaken. It's common enough it is not bizarre.

You're not the first to show Gaston in a favorable light, but you're the first to provide this specific interpretation about Gaston being some kind of Chad with a heart of gold, playing opposite the "hypergamous" Belle. There's no way they intended that.

As for the intentions, are you saying the intentions are objectively true or not? If we know what the movie is supposed to be about, is it objectively true that that's what the movie is about? And movies outline heroes and villains all the time. They go for certain portrayals. That's why we call them "Disney villains." There is no "Come to your own conclusions maybe Snow White should've died in that forest." You can come to your own conclusions if you want, but we're talking about what the writers intended.
 
That’s how they imagine we are to keep up their world view that women reward good male behavior with sex.

It’s really just mental gymnastics to reinforce their world views and protect their egos
 

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